Re: Raspberry Pi/clone(s) most ruggedizable for OLPC fieldwork?

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Re: Raspberry Pi/clone(s) most ruggedizable for OLPC fieldwork?

Adam Holt-2

On Feb 7, 2016 3:22 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> things like
> the PINE64 above it has a SoC attached network but not storage.

Both SATA (real TB+ disks) and Ethernet (external Wi-Fi AP antennae) are icing-on-the-cake we will both strongly consider.

> As is stands at the moment some of the best cheap devices for server
> style devices is AllWinner A20 devices (CubieTruck, BananaPi and
> friends) and i.MX6 devices (Wandboard, CuBox-i and friends)

Hugely helpful.

Key criterion for offline/remote deployments: does this accept 128GB MicroSD cards, so 2016's developing world $50-100 "knowledge hotspots" increasingly now become very real?  (Aside: 256GB MicroSD cards will be part of this well before 2020, apparently beyond the capability of most of these SoC's.)

Peter, does Fedora 24 have a shot to one day run on the "$19" Pine64 Plus?!  Even if it's ambiguous whether it can truly contain 2GB RAM as advertised, Pine64 claims to run up to 70C which is very promising if true.  ($15 Pine64 contains 512MB, and $19 "Pine64 Plus" contains 1GB RAM.  Their 2GB RAM story is very attractive, but may be marketing vaporware for now?)

Or...would you recommend other ruggedized platforms to run Fedora, for schools/libraries/clinics needing this in place by January 1st 2017?  (Thankfully size does not matter.  Cubox is very cute, and we will use it if it's the most rugged, but physically larger units are also fine too.  Certainly Fedora remains a priority for now, given schoolserver.org's obvious OLPC legacy +)


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Re: Raspberry Pi/clone(s) most ruggedizable for OLPC fieldwork?

Peter Robinson
On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 2:07 PM, Adam Holt <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Feb 7, 2016 3:22 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> things like
>> the PINE64 above it has a SoC attached network but not storage.
>
> Both SATA (real TB+ disks) and Ethernet (external Wi-Fi AP antennae) are
> icing-on-the-cake we will both strongly consider.
>
>> As is stands at the moment some of the best cheap devices for server
>> style devices is AllWinner A20 devices (CubieTruck, BananaPi and
>> friends) and i.MX6 devices (Wandboard, CuBox-i and friends)
>
> Hugely helpful.
>
> Key criterion for offline/remote deployments: does this accept 128GB MicroSD
> cards, so 2016's developing world $50-100 "knowledge hotspots" increasingly
> now become very real?  (Aside: 256GB MicroSD cards will be part of this well
> before 2020, apparently beyond the capability of most of these SoC's.)
>
> Peter, does Fedora 24 have a shot to one day run on the "$19" Pine64 Plus?!
> Even if it's ambiguous whether it can truly contain 2GB RAM as advertised,
> Pine64 claims to run up to 70C which is very promising if true.  ($15 Pine64
> contains 512MB, and $19 "Pine64 Plus" contains 1GB RAM.  Their 2GB RAM story
> is very attractive, but may be marketing vaporware for now?)

Yes, I've got one awaiting for me on my return to London. Kernel isn't
upstream, nor is u-boot, I'm not sure how big the patches are, I'm
hoping it'll all be landable in F-24.

> Or...would you recommend other ruggedized platforms to run Fedora, for
> schools/libraries/clinics needing this in place by January 1st 2017?
> (Thankfully size does not matter.  Cubox is very cute, and we will use it if
> it's the most rugged, but physically larger units are also fine too.
> Certainly Fedora remains a priority for now, given schoolserver.org's
> obvious OLPC legacy +)

Basically I'd want a specs set, I'm not sure why you'd want to use a
128Gb SD card over an actual SSD or HDD, the later are a lot more
robust. There's literally 100s of possible devices that would possibly
meet your needs, what would be great is a list of must haves and a
list of nice to haves and from that I could give a list of possible
options.
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Re: Raspberry Pi/clone(s) most ruggedizable for OLPC fieldwork?

Adam Holt-2


On Feb 7, 2016 9:59 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 2:07 PM, Adam Holt <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Feb 7, 2016 3:22 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> things like
> >> the PINE64 above it has a SoC attached network but not storage.
> >
> > Both SATA (real TB+ disks) and Ethernet (external Wi-Fi AP antennae) are
> > icing-on-the-cake we will both strongly consider.
> >
> >> As is stands at the moment some of the best cheap devices for server
> >> style devices is AllWinner A20 devices (CubieTruck, BananaPi and
> >> friends) and i.MX6 devices (Wandboard, CuBox-i and friends)
> >
> > Hugely helpful.
> >
> > Key criterion for offline/remote deployments: does this accept 128GB MicroSD
> > cards, so 2016's developing world $50-100 "knowledge hotspots" increasingly
> > now become very real?  (Aside: 256GB MicroSD cards will be part of this well
> > before 2020, apparently beyond the capability of most of these SoC's.)
> >
> > Peter, does Fedora 24 have a shot to one day run on the "$19" Pine64 Plus?!
> > Even if it's ambiguous whether it can truly contain 2GB RAM as advertised,
> > Pine64 claims to run up to 70C which is very promising if true.  ($15 Pine64
> > contains 512MB, and $19 "Pine64 Plus" contains 1GB RAM.  Their 2GB RAM story
> > is very attractive, but may be marketing vaporware for now?)
>
> Yes, I've got one awaiting for me on my return to London. Kernel isn't
> upstream, nor is u-boot, I'm not sure how big the patches are, I'm
> hoping it'll all be landable in F-24.

Profound thanks Peter.  More strategic than Nov 8th's election: we'll notify the Nobel committee ;)

> I'm not sure why you'd want to use a
> 128Gb SD card over an actual SSD or HDD, the later are a lot more
> robust.

In a perfect world: HDD/SSD robustnesses IS mandatory on the high-end.  We need offer both.  On the low-end dirt-poor clinics, libraries, school living in crushing poverty demand $15 64G Samsung MicroSD digital libraries...downloading as much knowledge (and Sugarizer) into their brains before device croaks after a year--or needs a new SD card after heavy use.

Ethics demand that we answer this request for a sub-$50 "knowledge hotspot", after our reservoir of recycled XO-1.5 community servers will sadly be depleted in the coming year or so.

> There's literally 100s of possible devices that would possibly
> meet your needs, what would be great is a list of must haves and a
> list of nice to haves and from that I could give a list of possible
> options.

Top Criteria:
- accepts 64G and increasingly 128G MicroSD cards
- internal Wi-Fi runs AP mode so "knowledge hotspot" can broadcast!
- runs Fedora 24, if not CentOS sometime in future?
- sufficient horsepower to deliver dynamic content like offline-searchable OpenStreetMap (2G RAM strongly preferred; 1G RAM may suffice for 2016?)

Highly Desirable Criteria:
- works up to ~70C as Pine64 claims, even in high humidity??
- tolerates crappy electricity & frequent outages, when external battery pack depleted by desperate nearby mobile phone users
- dust-proof case

Icing-on-the-cake Criteria: (high-end "$100 knowledge hotspots" in larger clinics/libraries/schools will kill for this!)
- Ethernet (100mb/s sufficient) for better Wi-Fi + antennae, mounted up high?
- SATA (2.5 inch 9mm HDD, mountable inside dust-proof case)
- MicroSD card can be glued in and/or hidden to avoid excess theft.  MicroSD cards often surpass the value of a month's salary; tragically these ARE the conditions we work in :/


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Re: Raspberry Pi/clone(s) most ruggedizable for OLPC fieldwork?

Adam Holt-2
Thanks Peter Robinson, Paul Fox and Dogi Unterhauser for your illuminating 2016's evolving and very promising options-

Preliminary conclusion is that we are buying a few $29 http://pine64.com (includes 2GB RAM) to experiment with.

What is the best mailing list to discuss Fedora (or non-Fedora) firmware, u-boot, kernel issues for Pine64 and similar, do you know?

(http://wiki.pine64.org is coming to life, which is a great start!)

On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Adam Holt <[hidden email]> wrote:


On Feb 7, 2016 9:59 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 2:07 PM, Adam Holt <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On Feb 7, 2016 3:22 AM, "Peter Robinson" <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> things like
> >> the PINE64 above it has a SoC attached network but not storage.
> >
> > Both SATA (real TB+ disks) and Ethernet (external Wi-Fi AP antennae) are
> > icing-on-the-cake we will both strongly consider.
> >
> >> As is stands at the moment some of the best cheap devices for server
> >> style devices is AllWinner A20 devices (CubieTruck, BananaPi and
> >> friends) and i.MX6 devices (Wandboard, CuBox-i and friends)
> >
> > Hugely helpful.
> >
> > Key criterion for offline/remote deployments: does this accept 128GB MicroSD
> > cards, so 2016's developing world $50-100 "knowledge hotspots" increasingly
> > now become very real?  (Aside: 256GB MicroSD cards will be part of this well
> > before 2020, apparently beyond the capability of most of these SoC's.)
> >
> > Peter, does Fedora 24 have a shot to one day run on the "$19" Pine64 Plus?!
> > Even if it's ambiguous whether it can truly contain 2GB RAM as advertised,
> > Pine64 claims to run up to 70C which is very promising if true.  ($15 Pine64
> > contains 512MB, and $19 "Pine64 Plus" contains 1GB RAM.  Their 2GB RAM story
> > is very attractive, but may be marketing vaporware for now?)
>
> Yes, I've got one awaiting for me on my return to London. Kernel isn't
> upstream, nor is u-boot, I'm not sure how big the patches are, I'm
> hoping it'll all be landable in F-24.

Profound thanks Peter.  More strategic than Nov 8th's election: we'll notify the Nobel committee ;)

> I'm not sure why you'd want to use a
> 128Gb SD card over an actual SSD or HDD, the later are a lot more
> robust.

In a perfect world: HDD/SSD robustnesses IS mandatory on the high-end.  We need offer both.  On the low-end dirt-poor clinics, libraries, school living in crushing poverty demand $15 64G Samsung MicroSD digital libraries...downloading as much knowledge (and Sugarizer) into their brains before device croaks after a year--or needs a new SD card after heavy use.

Ethics demand that we answer this request for a sub-$50 "knowledge hotspot", after our reservoir of recycled XO-1.5 community servers will sadly be depleted in the coming year or so.

> There's literally 100s of possible devices that would possibly
> meet your needs, what would be great is a list of must haves and a
> list of nice to haves and from that I could give a list of possible
> options.

Top Criteria:
- accepts 64G and increasingly 128G MicroSD cards
- internal Wi-Fi runs AP mode so "knowledge hotspot" can broadcast!
- runs Fedora 24, if not CentOS sometime in future?
- sufficient horsepower to deliver dynamic content like offline-searchable OpenStreetMap (2G RAM strongly preferred; 1G RAM may suffice for 2016?)

Highly Desirable Criteria:
- works up to ~70C as Pine64 claims, even in high humidity??
- tolerates crappy electricity & frequent outages, when external battery pack depleted by desperate nearby mobile phone users
- dust-proof case

Icing-on-the-cake Criteria: (high-end "$100 knowledge hotspots" in larger clinics/libraries/schools will kill for this!)
- Ethernet (100mb/s sufficient) for better Wi-Fi + antennae, mounted up high?
- SATA (2.5 inch 9mm HDD, mountable inside dust-proof case)
- MicroSD card can be glued in and/or hidden to avoid excess theft.  MicroSD cards often surpass the value of a month's salary; tragically these ARE the conditions we work in :/

--

Unsung Heroes of OLPC, interviewed live @ http://unleashkids.org !


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